Rising rate fuel regulator for supercharger?

warrior · Post by **warrior** » Tue Nov 06, 2012 9:07 pm

I see in the good old US OF A some cars with the Jackson racing superchargers use rising rate fuel regulators. Is there any reason this is a bad idea? I know there are BETTER ideas for fuelling of a supercharged engine but a fuel regulator is appox $100.00.

If anyone thinks this would be ok for a cheap solution to fuelling a supercharger please let me know or if you dont think its a good idea please also let me know.

SLYDIT · Post by **SLYDIT** » Tue Nov 06, 2012 9:17 pm

Using a fpr for a mx5 is a 15 year old way of doing things.
Fuelling a mx5 has come a LOOOOOOOONG way since then.
with an FPR you will need a fuel pump also.

There are other things to consider than just fuel....like timing and getting around the "closed loop lean spot" that requires an O2 clamp to fix...

buy a megasquirt and be done with it, or you will end up a) not getting enough HP out of your supercharger. B) spending a fortune on band aids to go along with the FPR.
for an FPR based system to make the most HP you'll need:
FPR
Fuel pump
Injectors
O2 clamp
Timing Controller
for a mega squirt you'll need:
Megasquirt
injectors
Throttle position sensor

i used an emanage piggy back/bigger injectors and an o2 clamp for my fuelling/timing solution back in 2005 and it still required some DIY electronics to get the most out of it.

if i were doing it today i'd use a megasquirt without any hesitation at all.

warrior · Post by **warrior** » Tue Nov 06, 2012 9:29 pm

What about the powercard that comes with all the jackson racing superchargers they sell, yes i,m sure its not as good as a megasquirt but at appox $380.00 and no dyno time it works out heaps cheaper.

warrior · Post by **warrior** » Tue Nov 06, 2012 9:30 pm

p.s I have upgraded the fuel pump

Angreal · Post by **Angreal** » Tue Nov 06, 2012 9:30 pm

warrior wrote:What about the powercard that comes with all the jackson racing superchargers they sell, yes i,m sure its not as good as a megasquirt but at appox $380.00 and no dyno time it works out heaps cheaper.

I've got one. Comes with the ffs which should land sometime before Christmas and ended up bypassing with hydra. No idea what they're worth but can't be that much plus has the convenience of plug and walk away. It has the normal pc for fueling and maybe a timing card but won't know till i open the box

Angreal · Post by **Angreal** » Tue Nov 06, 2012 9:33 pm

Sorry to hijack but at what point do you need to upgrade fuel pump? I was hoping to get away with the stock one

SLYDIT · Post by **SLYDIT** » Tue Nov 06, 2012 9:39 pm

Angreal wrote:Sorry to hijack but at what point do you need to upgrade fuel pump? I was hoping to get away with the stock one

the stock pump is not happy pushing 100psi at reasonable flow.
The FPR way is just band aid on top of band aid on top of band aid.
its been so long since people have done this that most of the knowledge on how to do it is hidden in the depths of miata.net archives.

After tuning the emanage with its full timing and fuel control i saw first hand how small changes in fuel/timing make big HP gains. With such a blunt way of tuning using a fpr you miss out on so much HP for your money (and fuel).

Angreal · Post by **Angreal** » Tue Nov 06, 2012 10:10 pm

I'm guessing that if my ecu tells me that I'm running lean under high load then I should up the pump, fuel rail and injectors? I guess if I'm after 10-12 psi then its a given that I shouldincrease those 3 items?

SLYDIT · Post by **SLYDIT** » Tue Nov 06, 2012 10:21 pm

Angreal wrote:I'm guessing that if my ecu tells me that I'm running lean under high load then I should up the pump, fuel rail and injectors? I guess if I'm after 10-12 psi then its a given that I shouldincrease those 3 items?

are you talking turbo or supercharger? whats the setup? where are you running lean?pump and rail should be fine at standard fuel pressure, maybe do a dual feed stock rail.

Angreal · Post by **Angreal** » Tue Nov 06, 2012 10:38 pm

SLYDIT wrote:
Angreal wrote:I'm guessing that if my ecu tells me that I'm running lean under high load then I should up the pump, fuel rail and injectors? I guess if I'm after 10-12 psi then its a given that I shouldincrease those 3 items?
are you talking turbo or supercharger? whats the setup? where are you running lean?pump and rail should be fine at standard fuel pressure, maybe do a dual feed stock rail.

I have a fast forward coldside supercharger mp62 which bolts in where the intake manifold is. Default is to run on the powercards but I'm installing my hydra 2.7 this weekend as it had a knock sensor along with a few other things. Planning to crank it to 10psi and try out their e cool (two additional injectors on the intake manifold to reduce the temp) as Iwont be running an intercooler. Stock engine except with exhintake. Stock fueling in terms of injectors, rail, pump but if need be i'll upgrade those.

Installing hydra ecu this weekend, supercharger over Xmas when I have time to take the car off the road.

WideOpenThrottle · Post by **WideOpenThrottle** » Wed Nov 07, 2012 8:46 am

At 9psi,stock fuel pump[as far as i know],duel feed fuel rail,550cc injectors my megasquirt set-up is happy as larry!

WideOpenThrottle · Post by **WideOpenThrottle** » Wed Nov 07, 2012 8:58 am

Angreal...according to Flyin Miata i think they recommend 6psi and certainly no more than 8psi for standard injectors [my 1600 had 1800 injectors and still didnt handle 8-10psi] otherwise you will run dangerously lean.Bigger injectors first, then see if your pump is up to it while tuning.

The biggest pump in the world still wont be able to push enough fuel through tiny injectors.

Your set-up will only be as good as the weakest link.

Angreal · Post by **Angreal** » Wed Nov 07, 2012 9:55 am

WideOpenThrottle wrote:Angreal...according to Flyin Miata i think they recommend 6psi and certainly no more than 8psi for standard injectors [my 1600 had 1800 injectors and still didnt handle 8-10psi] otherwise you will run dangerously lean.Bigger injectors first, then see if your pump is up to it while tuning.

The biggest pump in the world still wont be able to push enough fuel through tiny injectors.

Your set-up will only be as good as the weakest link.

Guess I'll be picking up some injectors and a fuel rail of some description then

WideOpenThrottle · Post by **WideOpenThrottle** » Wed Nov 07, 2012 1:12 pm

Here is my dual feed rail..cost me $30.00 maybe [fittings & hose].

warrior · Post by **warrior** » Wed Nov 07, 2012 8:08 pm

I have never heard anyone say anything good about the powercard " that comes with EVERY supercharger kit sold in the US or most of them, the thing is most people here know nothing about them. Yes a stand alone ecu WILL get you more power but how much? not much....thats how much. I can get a powercard delivered for $350.00nz and after all this is for a road car. NO DYNO COSTS END OF STORY. Cheap horespower.

warrior · Post by **warrior** » Wed Nov 07, 2012 8:15 pm

angreal......if you have bought a kit from the staes it will come with everything you need, dont change a thing. I upgraded the fuel pump but only because I was in the states at the time and it was cheap. If the kit does not tell you to change something then dont do it.

Snapfrozen · Post by **Snapfrozen** » Wed Nov 07, 2012 9:27 pm

Here's 1 question.

I haven't read up alot on these powercards. But how can someone create a "tune" for YOUR car, without tuning YOUR car. How can they allow for different fuel and spark setups and still give you a safe, reliable and good tune?

Angreal · Post by **Angreal** » Wed Nov 07, 2012 10:06 pm

warrior wrote:angreal......if you have bought a kit from the staes it will come with everything you need, dont change a thing. I upgraded the fuel pump but only because I was in the states at the time and it was cheap. If the kit does not tell you to change something then dont do it.

I guess I should order the optional extra's since I want to crank it up to 10pounds, or find suitable alternatives.

I assume they do something similar to a factory setting for a car. Set and forget. Close enough is good enough if everyone is sold the same kit.

Plus the hardcore fanatics who want power don't get plugnplay items anyway.

warrior · Post by **warrior** » Thu Nov 08, 2012 10:41 am

They are a piggyback sytem that is load based on boost. They are not perfect but are very good. You will get more power from a full ECU and tune but it will prob cost 10 x more, and we are only talking maybe 5% more power.

Have a search for the powercard and 95% of the people that have them are very happy with them.

Rising rate fuel regulator for supercharger?

Rising rate fuel regulator for supercharger?

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