Idea's on semi slicks

Discussions relating to MX5 Tyre choice, Wheels, Brakes Suspension components and other items to keep you going around corners, stuck to the ground or stopping on a dime.

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Donovan
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Idea's on semi slicks

Post by Donovan » Mon Aug 12, 2013 3:36 pm

Has anyone played around with different types of semi slick tyres for track days. I have had a set of Toyo R888, which have been trashed beyond belief until they become slick, then just canvas, so time to replace them.

Have been tossing up between another set of R888's, or Nitto NT01's or Dunlop Direzza D03G, but not sure if there are any real advantage of one over the other, seems to be vary opinions. Any other's that anyone wants to throw into the melting pot of idea's.

built4speed
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Post by built4speed » Mon Aug 12, 2013 4:01 pm

We run r888s on the cup cars and you cant beat them for value. I think we get them cheaper because toyo is the series supplier. I wouldn't bother forking out extra for dunlops unless your chasing the last 1/10s.
A few mates have tried nittos and they say they are junk, ones now back on r888s the other is on used slicks.

Ian
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Post by Ian » Mon Aug 12, 2013 6:31 pm

I use R888 and am very pleased with them.
In saying that, I did ask Brian Goodwin for his opinion between Nitto and Toyo, and he pointed out that they come out of the same factory...and in his opinion the Nitto is marginally quicker in the dry.
I respect his opinion.
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Snapfrozen
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Post by Snapfrozen » Mon Aug 12, 2013 8:39 pm

Couple of similar opinions.

1. For a wet/weekend car tyre, you cant go past the top end Bridgestones like an RE002. Theyre amazing in the wet but still wear well for daily/weekend use.

2. For semi slicks, dont be afraid to try the Achilles 123. I lost a fraction of a second compared to my R888 but they were literally half the price.

3. Note what compound your R888 are. Haven't looked recently but I know when I was racing on them you could only find hard ones. Haven't run mediums but on a light car like the 5 they might not wear fast? Also would be great as a wet tyre.

4. I hated running on slicks. I found they were VERY hard to heat up (the rears were my problem on a FWD), ended up trail braking with the ass everywhere for a few laps

Value for money = Achilles 123, love them
Best I've run = R888
Biggest let down = Dunlop 03G (Price vs performance, I'd rather run 2 sets of 123's instead)

BRM
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Post by BRM » Mon Aug 12, 2013 9:31 pm

Don't rule out Federals

We just started running them in our targa M3,
Was using Dunlops.

Turns out, for the money (a lot cheaper,maybe cheapest on the market)
theyre really good!
Don't think they have a soft compound yet, but have hard / mediums.
We run mediums on two M3s and a 328 and all feedback is pretty great.

And they never wear!

built4speed
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Post by built4speed » Mon Aug 12, 2013 9:41 pm

Snapfrozen wrote:Couple of similar opinions.

1. For a wet/weekend car tyre, you cant go past the top end Bridgestones like an RE002. Theyre amazing in the wet but still wear well for daily/weekend use.

2. For semi slicks, dont be afraid to try the Achilles 123. I lost a fraction of a second compared to my R888 but they were literally half the price.

3. Note what compound your R888 are. Haven't looked recently but I know when I was racing on them you could only find hard ones. Haven't run mediums but on a light car like the 5 they might not wear fast? Also would be great as a wet tyre.

4. I hated running on slicks. I found they were VERY hard to heat up (the rears were my problem on a FWD), ended up trail braking with the ass everywhere for a few laps

Value for money = Achilles 123, love them
Best I've run = R888
Biggest let down = Dunlop 03G (Price vs performance, I'd rather run 2 sets of 123's instead)
I found 123s shit when I ran them on the corolla last year. Easily a second or more slower. They went off fast and they had no where near the corner grip on the limit.

Slicks all come down to how old they are and if you set the car up to suit. I've found on light cars you won't warm them by swerving. You need to hammer the brakes. Even drive dragging them right from when you leave pit lane.

R888s aren't that harder compound. They work well from cold. First flying lap is normally within 1s of the fastest you'll post. Fastest is usually lap 3 traffic dependant. You can make a car come on when you want by setting tyre pressures properly. Hope this helps.

Snapfrozen
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Post by Snapfrozen » Tue Aug 13, 2013 7:24 am

I'll agree with the last comment. My experience on slicks is minimal so it was probably as much my own fault

BRM
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Post by BRM » Tue Aug 13, 2013 7:47 am

With slicks,
To get any actual use,
So they work..
You need to get them up to temp.
We run 280/680/18 they Should be getting up to et Least 90degrees

And that's in a 1350kg 600hp car.
The most we can get into them is 70 or 80 on a hot day really pushing it.

With out small light cars, you'd Really have to lean on them to get them up to temp, or you could be over tyred, which I think we are but, I don't pay the Bills.

Donovan
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Post by Donovan » Tue Aug 13, 2013 12:40 pm

Was going to run the Dunlop RE002 as a wet tyre and for my normal driving, the tyres that I have at the moment for that are rubbish, but they are what came with the rims, so just wearing them out (shouldn't take too long, well, not for the rears at lest).

Never heard of the Archilles or the Federal's, kinda leaning towards the Federal's maybe, where do you get them from, and I guess it all depends on the sizes, looks like I can only get 215/45/17 which means I might just have to suck it up and roll the guards, as I have been running 205/40/17 which have just fitted in there.

With the Federals, is that the 595RS-R or the FZ-201, assuming the latter.

BRM
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Post by BRM » Tue Aug 13, 2013 1:55 pm

Alert motorsport are the only dealers I know of.

Pretty certain they're 595 can find out

BRM
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Post by BRM » Tue Aug 13, 2013 2:01 pm

Alert motorsport are the only dealers I know of.

Pretty certain they're 595 can find out

Kieran
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Post by Kieran » Fri Aug 16, 2013 4:14 pm

Im running federal 595 evo's don't know how the Slicks are but from my experience

Pros

- Great in the DRY
- Very VERY durable (I just passed my 2nd WOF on the same set of tyres and they still have 5-6mm of tread all round)
- Good Price Point

Con (Sort of)

- Very loose in the wet

BRM
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Post by BRM » Fri Aug 16, 2013 4:46 pm

Kieran wrote:Im running federal 595 evo's don't know how the Slicks are but from my experience

Pros

- Great in the DRY
- Very VERY durable (I just passed my 2nd WOF on the same set of tyres and they still have 5-6mm of tread all round)
- Good Price Point

Con (Sort of)

- Very loose in the wet
That was our first worry with the Federals, they didnt wear.

But..
Are a good tyre for the price.

Did Targa rotorua on just one set..
With still 3-4mm tread left or more.
Barely used

Donovan
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Post by Donovan » Tue Aug 20, 2013 9:40 am

Have had a look at some pricing, and the Federal's don't seem to be all that cheap. These prices are per tyre, for the same size, include GST and fitting

Nitto NT01 - $330
Federal FZ-201 - $360
Toyo R888 - $380

Haven't got a price for the Dunlops yet, but I would suspect that they are around the price of the R888's, maybe a little bit more.

No considering that Toyo bought Nitto out a few years back, and by all accounts that I can find, that the R888 and the NT01 use exactly the same rubber compound, am I right in thinking I would be silly not to try the NT01's out for that kind of price difference?

Sure one the other side of the coin is life of the tyre, but I have done about 10 or so track days on my R888's, and the first one most likely caused most of the damage over that time, as I was learning about tyre pressure's then, and had them all wrong, so they were pretty much blob's of melted rubber on the rims by the end of a session.

I am still trying to find info on just how different the NT01's are to the R888's, other than tread pattern.

Snapfrozen
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Post by Snapfrozen » Tue Aug 20, 2013 7:34 pm

Price the Achilles 123... :P

Donovan
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Post by Donovan » Tue Aug 20, 2013 8:20 pm

Achilles 123S Circuit - $232, but they only do 205/45/17, and the other pricing was for 215/45/17.

How much a lap would I loose using these?

Snapfrozen
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Post by Snapfrozen » Tue Aug 20, 2013 9:16 pm

I would say unless you are racing, it is worth saving the money. I think I lost about 1s per lap on them. We didn't have a control tyre and I was never top of the grid so was more concerned about saving a decent amount of money..

SkilletKid
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Post by SkilletKid » Tue Aug 20, 2013 9:32 pm

Snapfrozen wrote:I would say unless you are racing, it is worth saving the money. I think I lost about 1s per lap on them. We didn't have a control tyre and I was never top of the grid so was more concerned about saving a decent amount of money..
So in as short a sentence as I can make:

Seat Time > 1~2s Lost with slightly worse tires

???
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